Have you ever wondered if you can have a pain free birth? OR if you should have a lotus birth? Are there benefits to eating your placenta?
Supraja and Sara take a deeper look into birthing trends, here's what you should know.
Have you ever wondered if you can have a pain free birth? OR if you should have a lotus birth? Are there benefits to eating your placenta?
Supraja and Sara take a deeper look into birthing trends, here's what you should know.
Well, here we are, episode five. How's it feel for you?
Sara:I heard that most podcasts die after episode seven.
Supraja:Oh my God. Wait, we're not a success story yet.
Sara:No,
Supraja:but it could still be a cheers.
Sara:This could still be upon us.
Supraja:What did you \make us? This is looking very fancy.
Sara:Campari spritzers.
Supraja:I don't even know what any of those words mean.
Sara:Couple of ounces of Campari Uhhuh tonic water and a splash of vermouth.
Supraja:Oh, well, it tastes very fancy. Like you should be selling this outside and have a stoop bar.
Sara:Literally, I knew you were coming over and I was scrambling. I was like, Ugh, I have nothing.
Supraja:!Because I forced Sara to give me alcohol every time she sees me. When I walked in today, Sara said, I think I feel bad because I've been drinking too much, but now this is making more sense. That just seeing me put the pressure on for you.
Sara:I know it's cuz I feel like once the summer comes, everybody's like, let's go out to dinner. And then I have two drinks and I've had four dinners and I'm just like, I feel disgusting.
Supraja:Should we just fake a pregnancy? Will that help? You'll have an out
Sara:it'll just ruin my dating life. No. You um, okay. Because I'm happily enjoying this Campari Spritzer for
Supraja:Yeah. You're like, wait, I only felt that way before you put a drink in my hand. Um, no, but Sara, Sara was very brave today. Sara, do you wanna tell our listeners
Sara:Oh, what'd I do
Supraja:you texted an ex?
Sara:Well, he is not an X.
Supraja:Okay. Right
. Sara:We went on like three dates. He's not an X. I haven't had an X in a long time.
Supraja:Have you heard Nick Viall say Don't text your ex. But then
Sara:he's not an ex, so I'm good.
Supraja:And you have a Supraja who like aggressively made you text. Okay. Yeah. Tell, explain the situation.
Sara:Well, okay. You know, I went on a few dates with this person like months ago, but they were such good dates and then all of a sudden he just disappeared. Another term for that would be,
Supraja:Ghost. Ghost,
Sara:he ghosted away just like my life story right now.
Supraja:Which is so odd cuz he, every date I remember he would tell you like, I really enjoyed this. Let's please do it again. it was like progressing in a normal fashion.
Sara:Yeah. Well and then he just like disappeared and I'm, I'm kind of of the mindset that Well, if somebody's not like, I think
Supraja:it's not for you to convince them to stay. Like for what?
Sara:I think in the past I used to, I feel like that's like, you know, like, I don't know. All my daddy issues, all proof.
Supraja:We're trying, trying to be healthier here
Sara:to stay in my life, and now I'm like, no, I don't care anymore.
Supraja:Yeah. It's like me repeating to myself like chaos is not positive, fights are not good. Fights are not good. Conversations are better.
Sara:Well, so I think about him intermittently cuz he really was so lovely and it was such a bummer. I was sad for a long time. Yeah, I was like really sad for a while. I don't know why I haven't let somebody like jerk my feelings around like that for a while.
Supraja:But also he didn't really jerk your feelings around. It was like steady reassurance and then just gone.
Sara:Yeah.
Supraja:It's like the type of person you would like start looking in obituaries or like put out like an amber alert.
Sara:Yeah. I was like, what happened usually I could tell when I've done something to offend somebody. Yeah. Because usually it's purposeful anyways, so then you know, I've intermittently thought about it and so then I've been telling Supraja, I was like, well, you know, blah, blah, blah, and she's like, why don't we text him?
Supraja:Because it has been like, it has been months, months, like since, and Sara, go ahead.
Sara:October, November, I think.
Supraja:I was trying to remember. Yeah, I thought fall. But yeah, so, and now it's almost the end of June and Sara has dated many other people since then. But like occasionally you'll just always be like, yeah, I really liked that guy. And you also say that you felt like he was soul searching. You kind of gave him a pass a little bit.
Sara:Yeah. I could tell he was, I could tell he was going through this like life thing, but I was like, I'll solve your life. I'm the solution.
Supraja:Let me make you whole. You need more love. I'm an anxious person.
Sara:You're an avoidant. I'm anxious.
Supraja:That was like their first date.
Sara:Yeah.
Supraja:We're like this. This guys definitely gonna know what you're talking about. Him. We're like, and then he said this and then he wore this. Well, anyways, but look at our show notes for their texts. Kidding?
Sara:!I'll put up the screenshots.
Supraja:So Sara texted him because I was just like, well, you're holding onto this anyway. Right? And it's something you don't really have. Yeah. So it's not something you can lose. Yeah. So why not? Why not be brave enough to put a little feeler out there and then use it as evidence either way. Like either that goes somewhere or you let it go, or at least it's like a little bit of a weight off. I feel like people are just too scared to be vulnerable. You know? Like everybody's always trying to cut it off before someone hurts them or like assume the worst of someone. And I will say that I tend to the opposite. I'm like, he's such a beautiful person.
Sara:You're like, you're too. Whereas I'm just like, He's the dead.
Supraja:Yeah. Well, I need to be reeled in. Like, I'm like, oh, this guy like took me out one time, was semi inappropriate. Never spoke to me again. He's such a beautiful person though.
Sara:I'm like, that man is the devil. Yeah. Don't ever talk about about that. Is there,
Supraja:I know exactly what you're talking,
Sara:I know what you're talking about. That man is the devil. I hate him,
Supraja:I've worked on that, but I think there's a middle ground of like, you can give people a chance. Knowing we all do some dumb stuff. Yeah. Well this person, but then let believe them if they show it to you again. Yeah.
Sara:Okay. Well I didn't think this person was a bad person.
Supraja:Right.
Sara:Um, and what was I gonna say? Well, so we texted him.
Supraja:Yes.
Sara:He took a day to respond crap.
Supraja:This is not sounding as good in the retell.
Sara:But then the convo we had was actually really sweet. Sweet. It was really nice. It was very like, and he apologized, is really nice.
Supraja:Everybody's always apologizing to Sara.
Sara:People do, men do apologize to me.
Supraja:Men don't apologize to me. Not like that.
Sara:I get men apologize to me all the time. I don't know why. I think it's cuz I have such like a sad face that they're just like, No. How could I not apologize to this?
Supraja:No, I think I apologize cuz you're so, like, you're so earnest and so like pure at heart and so people feel bad when they've like royally. Messed with you.
Sara:I dunno. Well, it was a nice convo and we were both like, well, let's, I hope our pot paths cross. One day I was like, I'll, this is my address. You know where I live? Just kidding.
Supraja:You're like, tomorrow. Tomorrow you want them to cross?
Sara:Tatte coffee and a croissant. I, I'm just kidding. Well, anyways, that was my moment of courage this week. Yeah. I'm really glad I did it. And who knows, I might never see this person again, but it felt nice to like take my shot and, yeah. You know,
Supraja:let's just leave a door open
. Sara:Yeah. And I'm kind of just trying to live spontaneous, like not be so , you know, just who knows what tomorrow will bring. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Supraja:I love it.
Sara:Makes me more calm it, somebody said that to me recently. You see, oh, I think it was you, you were like, you seem so like calm lately.
Supraja:You do.
Sara:I think it's cause I keep telling myself like, eh, whatever.
Supraja:Or like it's gonna be okay, I'm just
Sara:like, even I was doing this vacuum with the resident and another attending yesterday. It looks
Supraja:a vacuum for people who don't know this is, so, Sara was on call at the hospital yesterday and A vacuum is when a baby is not coming out of the birthing canal, but it's almost there. And sometimes we can put basically like a suction cup temporarily on a baby's head and help assist pull the baby out. So, and it's kind of a scary thing. I mean, we do it all the time, but it definitely is something that's, You do it when you, your choices are becoming limited and it can go in any direction. Like if, if it doesn't work, you have to emergently do a C-section. But a lot of times it works no problem. But it definitely is like an upping the stakes.
Sara:You're like picking the right candidate, you're being mindful yeah. And so I hate doing them. I'm good at them. I just don't like doing them. I'm very selective of who I choose for you. And so, but, and you don't do that like no one does them all the time. That'd be weird if you Yeah. Be weird all the time. That'd be like, okay, that's another problem. So it just doesn't happen enough that you feel. A hundred percent about it every time. Well, I just stayed so calm and somebody after was like, you just seem so like calm and mellow. Because if you knew me years ago, I was like, I had told somebody, I was like, well, one time, one of my chiefs gave me this advice. Like you can't tell. But I'm screaming in my head right now. Yeah, yeah. It's just nobody else can tell. And that's, I say that to residents sometimes. I'm like, you don't realize it, but we're all freaking out. Yeah. Like I'm very anxious and nervous, but I realize like, When I feel like when you're in a certain role, people are looking to you as a leader. Yeah. To convey like I. This like sense of like, I got this. Yeah, we're gonna be good. And so I try so hard to be like tranquility for people. Yeah. I'm trying really hard to, I think I'm doing a,
Supraja:you're doing great.
Sara:I think I'm doing good. And it also gives me tranquility. It helps me be mindful and resets my thought process, which, you know, it's gonna segue into this episode soon.
Supraja:Yeah, that's true. Birthing trends. Birthing trends. Should we do it? Should we talk about birthing trends?
Sara:Yeah. So why did you picked this episode?
Supraja:I did. Well, because I'm trying to be in with the younger kids and do the whole TikTok sitch.
Sara:You're younger than me. I mean,
Supraja:I wasn't gonna put you on blast if you wanna take it fine. Barely. I'm like a year younger than Sara. She acts like I'm a toddler or something like, but I do appreciate, I walk in, she gives me food and alcohol.
Sara:Yeah, I was like, you want salad?
Supraja:I'm like, yeah, actually, no., well just. I feel like it's just been around the, all these videos I've been finding about things like hypno birds and eating your placenta. All these people in popular culture, doing it like. I think Kourtney Kardashian ate her placenta, so I was really interested also, because we don't really learn about that in our education. All these alternative birthing trends, I think because they're not very, uh, evidenced based necessarily. And that's not to say. That there's anything wrong with them, just as a concept, but we just haven't spent that much time studying them. Yeah. So it's not something we're presented in like medical school or training. Mm-hmm. Which tends to be very evidence-based, like looking at large studies of like thousands and thousands of people, um, which just hasn't been done about things like hypnobirth really.
Sara:I feel like it'll come up when like a patient, so, you know, just to give some context, we deliver at a big tertiary care center in Boston and a lot of our patients are medically complicated., I remember in residency we had midwives for one year and then the hospital. You know, unfortunately sent them to different hospitals and so we really, I only got to learn from midwives for a few months as an intern. Yeah. And then that's it. And I, yeah, I don't know what your residency was like.
Supraja:We definitely had midwives who worked with us a lot in the clinics. And then towards the end of my residency they started taking call with us too, which was awesome. But still, I think a lot of these trends, It's just not something we talked about even with our midwives. Um, and the ones we wanna talk to you about today are hypnobirthing,
Sara:uh, lotus birth and
Supraja:eating Your Placenta,
Sara:or, I learned the new word for this, or the word for it. placentophagia Placentophagia. Well I feel like this comes up because patients will ask during clinic visits, do you guys have midwives? And first of all, I'm like, no, I'm a doctor. I'm like, I wish we did it, but yeah, we don't. Um, and then, then they'll ask, oh, do you guys have a birthing center? I'm like, No. And they're like, can we birth at a tub in the one tub we have? I'm like, no.
Supraja:Like I feel like, but I think that's like why people are searching for this kind of information. Mm-hmm. Because people just want to feel more connected with what's happening to their body and their childbirth. They want it to be less medicalized or like less intervention focused. So I do feel like a lot of these. Trends have come up because people want to feel more centered in their experience, um, and to feel like they have more control over their experience, which I totally get, but it's, yeah. I think it's interesting for us coming from like such a background of data and science looking into this stuff is really a totally different way of thinking about childbirth
Sara:it was actually very interesting and super interesting to learn about some of these things just because they will occasionally come up. I feel like of all these three things I see hypnobirthing the most. I've only seen one person do a lotus birth.
Supraja:I feel like people ask me about eating their placenta all the time, but the placentaphagia, I get that.
Sara:I see it a handful of times a year where the patient asked for the, um, to take their placenta with them. And so it's kind of fun to actually look it up.
Supraja:But , you know, there's this whole thing on TikTok where it's like, do not let them sell your placenta. Don't let them take and sell your placenta. So I was like, who is selling placenta? Like, I'm not aware of that.
Sara:Well, didn't you just see that whole Harvard scandal?
Supraja:Were they selling placenta?
Sara:Well, the cadavers,
Supraja:well they were Seriously, yeah.
Sara:You didn't read about it? No, we got a newsletter about it. It was in the news.
Supraja:What happened?
Sara:Well, that's a Let's talk. Wait.
Supraja:No, you have to explain. Now.
Sara:I don't even know the full story, but inappropriately, they were collecting like, Parts from the bodies in the morgue and selling them. This is recently? This is, yes. Recently. Who were they selling? Was in the news to like people who were not using it for medical purposes.
Supraja:Oh yeah. That's terrifying. Yeah. Yeah. Well, this is why there's so much distrust and there's like a whole history of oh, a hundred percent. Especially in underrepresented, disadvantaged communities their bodies being taken advantage for science and other purposes. So I get where it comes from., But yeah, it was interesting to talk about. So like hypnobirthing, I guess to start. Yes. Which I will also say that I feel like I have a dual personality. I'm a Gemini, but part of my, part of my dual personality is like, part of me is like, oh, science. Medicine, et cetera. But then if I have a headache, like I will not take medication for it. Like I was so na like I, I've confessed this before. I not been to a PCP since my pediatrician. Like I'm terrible. So I am totally someone who would come in and be like, let me do a hypnobirth, but my profession also makes it so I know a little bit more. Yeah. But okay. Hypnobirthing, Sara. So hypnobirthing is this idea of using kind of self hypnosis or really meditation and relaxation to get you through your birth, and it's sold as a pain-free birth, which is kind of a stretch, right?
Sara:Well, not for people who like truly,
Supraja:oh, well that's what she's a believer now. No, literally we had this whole prep session where we like talked about all this and now she's like, no, it is pain free.
Sara:Well, I feel like, well, that's how it's like, like implied when you watched the videos and how like Yeah. When I looked at the different programs that. You know, teach these courses. I think that is the goal, essentially, is to have,
Supraja:the aim is to have a pain-free birth.
Sara:Yeah. Or to take such control of your discomfort that your coping mechanism is, you know, I. I mean, to me it seems like I could never do that, but it sounds incredibly like incredible in all honesty.
Supraja:Yeah. But if it would work, yeah,
Sara:if it works, and it seems like it does for many women, but they're in incorporate Well, it says, it seems like they're trying not to be canceled. I know. Don't cancel Me too.
Supraja:That's literally like this, like good cop, bad cop situation where we were like aligned and now Sara feels strongly she needs to be the good cop.
Sara:That's because I was like Supraja I prepped for this, this episode. I don't know. I don't, I feel like I'm gonna get canceled talking about this stuff, but I'm, I'm mentioning my bias. Okay.
Supraja:Yeah. Yeah. Our bias is that we. Went to medical school and then we trained and have been practicing at a very academic institution with high risk patients. Yeah. Where oftentimes we cannot incorporate some of these, well, some of them we could, but it's just, it just doesn't always make sense. But I think that's why I like reading about stuff like that. Yeah. Cause it does challenge you a little bit. Yes. And it makes you think like these things often are not harmful and maybe for the right person it's helpful. Yeah. But, okay. So Hypnobirth, components of it. One is really relaxation and calming techniques where people talk about breathing. So like box breathing for example, where you breathe in for four, or hold for four, breathe out for eight. Or some combination of that, uh, where you're breathing in, holding, =breathing out. Really the same concepts I feel like you learn in any meditative practice. Mm-hmm. Or even just like anxiety techniques. To calm yourself. So that's part of it. And then visualizing something that you don't associate with pain. So I think a lot of videos have been talking about like flowers. Like you imagine a contraction, like a flower of the way. See, Sara's coming out. She's making a face of me.
Sara:No. Well, okay. One of the examples I heard a woman explain was like, I just kept imagining that this contraction is gonna result in me being one step closer to delivering my baby. Yeah. Holding my baby meeting. So it's like reframing your thought process. So, and which is the part of it that I really did appreciate. Right? Yeah. It's mindfulness. Yeah. Yeah. It's giving it a new perspective to something where you are in control. You do have, you are the narrative of your own story. Yeah. And I did like and appreciate that. I think I'm just a wimp when it comes to like, I could barely tolerate my I U D exchange. I was like dying. Yeah. I'm like crawling up the exam table. So mema like I, this is what I do for a living. I watch people deliver babies. It's quite uncomfortable for most women.
Supraja:I know. People are like, will this hurt? I'm like, Yes, but okay. Yes. So the mindfulness, trying to associate with it with something that's not just pain, um, which is just a coping strategy, I, I agree is beautiful. Like the other example I thought I, um, you know, uh, people giving affirmations and one of the ways one of the women described her contractions was, not, oh, I have 10 more contractions in this next hour, but rather, Yeah, I have one contraction to go through and this will get me closer to the delivery of my baby. Positive affirmations, reframing the perspective, and then using these, um, pressure point techniques, holding onto combs, breathing techniques to really. Get through what has traditionally been a very uncomfortable, you know, process for most women. Yeah. So that's the third part is the redirection of pain. Yes. And people will use things like massage or combs in your hand to redirect pain. So that's the three , like relaxation techniques, breathing. And visualizing something other than pain, like the flower and then the redirection of pain so there actually have been some studies that look at this and see if it's effective in what you're hoping to accomplish. And I know you read a Cochran review.
Sara:Yeah, yeah. I think the unfortunate thing about most of these trends is they are so poorly studied and so it's not to say that these things don't work, it's just there's very little literature. About it, like meaning that people just haven't studied a lot of women. But for this one there was, um, a big review that involved around 3000 women, which is pretty decent actually.
Supraja:Yeah, it was like nine trials. That they combine Cochran interviews or reviews that combine different studies to tell you a broad consensus basically that they made based on those studies. Yeah, so it was nine different studies, over 3000 people, and in that study it didn't show a decrease in pain and also didn't show a decrease in the C-section rate. But it did show that it , may have been helpful in the first phase of labor.
Sara:Yes. These women who did implement these birthing techniques were less likely to use. Medications for pain control like nitrous, which is the laughing gas or narcotics, but they were just as likely to get epidurals, so it didn't prevent that either. Yeah, but I mean, I think all of that is to still say, which hopefully we've summarized, we were kind of clearly were fighting through our feelings about this too. You're getting a pre fully formed opinion. But I think if you're someone where I. That type of meditative technique. Relaxation is something you could employ. It probably helps with everything and it helps as a lifestyle that you can also apply to birthing. There's just no right way to have a baby, and there's no shame in any. Any pain control method that you use, um, and know that most people, like, you're not able to just train your mind not to feel pain in an extremely painful situation. So that's just an unrealistic expectation to have for yourself. There's no shame in that either. Yeah. I feel like I, I liked learning about this. I thought it was really interesting and I liked you know, reading about some of the women, granted their anecdotes, but the women who were successful were, you know, some of the women who really. Implemented these techniques into their daily life. They didn't just go to courses for a couple of hours. Yeah. Each session and then suddenly arrived in labor and, you know, were successful. It sounds like, you know, really incorporating these approaches to discomfort, pain, whatever it may be on a daily basis, help them be successful. And I, I like that because I feel like that to me seems realistic, you're essentially practicing every day. Like whether you're training for a marathon, you're rehearsing for a presentation, it's really what you put in that you might ultimately get out as a result. Yeah, and none of this is dangerous. It, it's really like how you want to take charge of that special day for you. And I think this makes me. You know, more excited to talk about with patients, like what techniques are you learning? Like, I wanna know,
Supraja:I kinda wanna hypno birth.
Sara:I, I feel like I'll make it to two centimeters and then I'll be like,
Supraja:I know I'm gonna box, breathe for the first two centimeters and then be like, get me my epidural. Yeah, no, just kidding. No, but really, I was like, that's cool. I think I agree with you knowing that these are good techniques to employ in your life and then you can utilize them. Hopefully if it's something that you want, you're someone it is really successful for. But know that labor is just an evolution. Like you don't really know what to expect, and there are lots of valid ways to go through it. Um, it's all beautiful, you know?
Sara:Yeah, yeah. And have a support team there, if you feel like that'll help you be more successful, um, whether that be a doula or a partner who's participated in these Sessions with you.
Supraja:Yeah. That's a really good point of having a support person . Okay. Lotus Birds, Sara, let go off on Lotus Birds. Are you gonna be just as good cop about this?
Sara:No. Uh, okay.
Supraja:No, because just gimme a warning if you're about to sell me out on, no, I didn't sell you out on it. I'm just, I'm just kidding.
Sara:I don't wanna get canceled. I'm just kidding. No. Okay. Lotus Birth, what That, first of all, that's an interesting name, but I learned that it comes from the woman who, one of the original people who did it in the 1970s. Claire Lotus Day.
Supraja:I want my name to be Lotus. That is a pretty cool name. Claire Lotus Day. No. One's day was about to name it like Rajagopalan birth.
Sara:Mine's Sara Ann McKinney. I sound like I like turn butter . I love Grand Lakes butter. Okay. Lotus birth, a lotus birth is essentially, you know, usually after you have a baby, they cut the umbilical cord of the baby and the baby remains with a little like three to four centimeter stump. That eventually falls off after a week or so. Um, and a lot of practices will do like delayed cord clamping.
Supraja:Yeah. I think that started when we were in residency, which was somewhere in the last eight years that became a more common. Practice where basically you wait 30 to 60 seconds after the baby's delivered to clamp and cut the cord. And that has actually had pretty good research behind it, especially for babies that are premature. You know, it can help increase how much blood gets to the baby, so decreases the likelihood of transfusions as well as some other infant complications. Um, but Lotus births. Are a little bit different.
Sara:You essentially don't cut the cord and you let the, you keep the placenta attached to the baby
Supraja:until it falls off on its own, which can take three to 10 days. And it's kind of nuts because you expect that that tissue within five to 10 minutes has zero blood flow going to it, which means that the tissue actually necrosis
Sara:like dies. Yes. There's literally no more blood pumping after a few minutes. Right. You can feel the pulse, the it just stops completely.
Supraja:Yeah. And obviously still this is a personal decision because it's your, your body grew a placenta, grew a baby, it's what you wanna do with it. But I, there was a lot more convincing evidence that there are potential harms to having a lotus birth. Yeah. And the main thing being that if you're carrying around a bunch of tissue that now is to necrosed attached to your child, it just becomes a nidus for infection. And that's the thing that , you get scared the most about that that tissue can get infected and then the umbilical stump can get infected. And that actually can be pretty dangerous for the infant.
Sara:And when I was trying to figure out why people do this, like what are people hoping to gain from this? Like what are the benefits? I really couldn't find a lot of stuff, in all honesty. Yeah. You know, it sounds like this woman who originally did in the seventies did it because. She watched an animal do it. She saw chimpanzee do it. No, I swear that's what it says.
Supraja:But still like this idea of being close to the placenta or doing something with it, I think does come from this idea of going back to what's primitive and being less medical, which is what sort of all the trends are about.
Sara:And when I looked up a lit, did a literature review. And when I say literature review, I'm essentially saying , I'm looking through a database that hosts journals to see who has studied this and , what have the studies demonstrated. Mm-hmm. And there have literally been less than a handful of studies in the last
Supraja:I'll ever talk about this.
Sara:Yeah. And so I was like, really, this is the, this was the most limited of all the things. That were mentioned. Well, actually, hypnobirthing was quite limited as well., but, but not as, it doesn't seem as harmful to me. The Lotus birth, I just had a harder time wrapping my head around it.
Supraja:It's a whole industry of doing things like this. There's a whole, all these communities and industries that also make money off of getting people to invest in stuff like this, which I think complicates it for me. I totally get, people are feeling let down by the medical system. They feel like they can trust their providers less. That interactions feel really transactional. Don't take time to assess values and so people are really craving external ways of being safe and getting back to who we are without all these interventions, but then there are all these industries that take advantage of it, like industries making bags for this stuff. Or like when we talk about placenta faia, it's like a huge industry of encapsulating people's placenta. Like those people are making money off of it, and they want you to see the information that says, this is good. You know, none of it is without bias. So I think it can be a little tricky to sort through.
Sara:so I, I had a harder time cause I didn't really read about a lot of benefits.
Supraja:Sorry, Sara,
Sara:to the baby
Supraja:I'm ruining Sara's beautiful home.
Sara:Um, but potential risks to the baby, including infection of the stump that remains, which can actually be quite severe in certain babies requiring, you know, IV antibiotics., and so I just think this one, I think anytime we do anything, we should always be thinking what are, what are the benefits? What are the pros, what are the cons? And so you know, this one, if you do end up doing it, it's, making sure you have a pediatrician who feels. You know, comfortable following up on this close examination, making sure the baby's not developing any redness or signs of infection. Yeah. And if the baby does, then you know, truly considering detaching the placenta and, seeing if any additional interventions are needed.
Supraja:Yeah, I think that's super important. Having a pediatrician who is on board with helping you follow your baby because if you are gonna do that, then for the first three to 10 days, you'll need multiple visits with them to look at the attachment site like you said. And I mean, if someone told me they really wanted to do this, I would never be like, oh no. Well, I can't talk to you about it.
Sara:Yeah, a hundred percent. But I would wanna know so we could have an educated conversation about it and then if you decided you wanted to do it, I would do my best to help facilitate doing it in a safe way.
Supraja:Yeah. So having a provider that's gonna listen to you and help you get it done in a safe way if you really still are set on it, is important.
Sara:Yeah, I think with the one patient I took care of who had this done, the neonatologist came down to talk to her and talked about pros and cons. Had to sign a consent form and that was that. Yeah, it's just getting more information people to help guide you in making that decision.
Supraja:Yeah. Okay. placentaphagia. Our last placentaphagia our last trend for today. All right. Are you going to eat your placenta? Should you? You know how many videos there are online of people making placenta smoothies. It is outrageous.. If you wanna spend a lot of hours on scrolling social media and then not knowing what to make of what you just saw, like should it be in a film? Should it be classified health or horror just search placenta smoothies.
Sara:Well, but. I think it's interesting because I think the placenta Okay, I'm not being good cop again.
Supraja:No, I actually this, I feel all of it. I feel very mixed about. Well, but go ahead.
Sara:I think the placenta is so fascinating. It's so cool. It's, it is the most amma, I think it's the most amazing organ. Oh. It's like literally this filter that like feeds your baby, takes all the bad stuff away, you know? Yeah. It's incredible what it does.
Supraja:You literally grow an organ to grow a human. Like it's insane.
Sara:But once the placenta delivers,
Supraja:You don't care.
Sara:No, I don't. It's gets cold. It's mushy. It, it's just, it's, it's like my, my least favorite thing to touch up for delivery.
Supraja:Yeah. Really? Yeah. Yes. I like it.
Sara:I like it when it's still warm, but once it gets cold.
Supraja:Oh, that's so interesting. Well, okay, so people eat their placenta in many different ways. Although I just spent a lot of time telling you about smoothies, that's actually not the most common way, the most common way is to get it made into pill forms. Mm-hmm. Which again, I get, I have mixed feelings about, because there's a whole industry around doing this where people like for profit companies are making money off of telling you that, that you should encapsulate your placenta and eat it. Probably costs around one to $500 is what I read for one placenta. And then some people eat it raw, cook it, blend it.
Sara:I actually looked up how many calories are in the placenta. Oh yeah. Three, like around 350 calories.
Supraja:I would've thought it was more,
Sara:I would've thought substantially more. Yeah. That's like nothing.
Supraja:It's like pretty, like beefy.
Sara:Yeah. Well, and, and even the grams of protein and vitamins and nutrients, it's really not that much. Yeah. When you look, well, I didn't give the exact breakdown, but it, I did mention them a number of grams of protein and stuff. It was like 50 grams of protein. But still, I just thought it was interesting, like, okay, what's the, what are we actually getting out of it?
Supraja:Yeah. Which it doesn't seem like there a lot of studies that talk about the benefit mm-hmm. Other than self-reported people saying that they personally found benefit to it. Um, the, the thing that people are worried about again, just that when you take tissue that is no longer being fed by blood, the tissue dies and then can get infected. So there have been cases of , group B streps, salmonella. There's concern that could cause a severe infection in the baby. And there's one specific case out of Oregon where they found this infant had late onset GBS bacteremia where they had, , the bacteria all through their blood, which is a very serious thing, and they found the same strain of that. In the placenta. So they linked them, which is kind of a theoretical link. You know, it's hard to say if that really was the cause, but that caused a lot of the panic around this concept., but if you wanna do it, like there's no in industry standard or formal certification for it, which also makes it difficult. But things that we do know is you really should refrigerate it. Um, and you wanna make sure it's super hygienic. Like you've gotta wash your hands. You have to use companies that can be vetted as much as you're able. You wanna limit cross-contamination, and you really want to keep a close eye on your infant if you're gonna do this, and tell your pediatrician that you did it so that you're. Especially if you're breastfeeding. So people are keeping track of all of those things
Sara:and the benefit that people are, you know, hoping to get from the. Placenta, yeah. Is essentially like decreased rates of postpartum depression, maternal fatigue, improved breastfeeding reduced bleeding. But again, when I did a lit review, I couldn't find any big studies that
Supraja:showed it,
Sara:that demonstrated that. And again, that's not to say that that's not true. It's just. We don't know.
Supraja:Yeah.
Sara:And so I think we have to be, you know, I think if a patient asks me, I would just say that, and that's what I say about a lot of things when patients ask, can I take this medication? Actually, it hasn't been well studied. And when we haven't studied something, at length, we generally don't recommend it. Mm-hmm. Because why take the risk? And so I think just being mindful of those things, is important. Yeah. And having all the information before you make a decision. So, yeah.
Supraja:Yeah. Well, I really loved learning about this stuff and thinking about it more because I, I really feel like it all comes from this place of people wanting to have more control of their bodies and wanting to feel like less interventions are pushed on them , people feeling misunderstood by the medical system. It kind of drives a lot of that, so I having more, , ability to talk about it with people and ability to take some of those tenants into our practice
Sara:yeah, I feel like
Supraja:even if I didn't sound like I liked any of this, I actually thought I was cool. Yeah.
Sara:But I feel like now I, I'll be better equipped at answering questions or when things come up, because I've been really better at asking people what are your plans for pain control? Yeah. Um, what were your goals for the delivery? Or do you have a birthing plan that you want us to review together? Or even after the delivery, like I. I, I've started asking like, what was your delivery like? Yeah. I wanted to hear your perspective.
Supraja:And people have so much trauma around their delivery that's just not acknowledged at all. Like it is a crazy thing that happens where you grow a child and then it comes out of you and then you're just. Sent out in the world, like you're supposed to know what to do. So yeah, I've been trying to be good about unpacking that with people, even if they say like, oh, I had a positive experience. Probably their emotions are more layered than that. Yeah, and beforehand too, trying to ask like, how do you envision this in your ideal situation?
Sara:Yeah. Because I think, again, I think you're right. It's, people wanting to have. You know, there's so little control. We have, in obstetrics, so in life. Yeah. In life and, and yeah, in life. And you know, the more we know, at least we can, at least the way I like to approach life is I have very little control of a lot of things. You know? I. Don't know what I'm gonna meet my person, for example.
Supraja:But guys, if you know people who should be with Sara, send them my way and I'll bet.
Sara:Yeah, actually some, one of the attendings we work with was like, well, are you up for being set up? And I was like,
Supraja:ask me.
Sara:I was like, I am Supraja. This is my type and you need to send a photo to Supraja. I literally said that
Supraja:you did good, because I've said, Nope, cuz people have shown me before and I've been like, no. Yeah.
Sara:And I finally have been better about, show me a photo.
Supraja:Sara would go on all these blind dates and not ask to see a photo, which I, I'm not trying to be shallow, like I think people are, lots of people are handsome in their own ways, but everybody has a type like you can tell if you're gonna be attracted to someone or not. Yeah. At least you couldn't tell if they're in the realm of person you would be attracted to. So like, who sets someone up but doesn't show them a photo? Like, that's crazy. Yeah. Well, in the past when my friends have sent me up, Sara, they literally sent me paragraphs and multiple photos.
Sara:No, I didn't get any photos. And then I, I always said yes, and then I Google stalk and I was like, oh. Well, maybe they have a beautiful personality.
Supraja:Yeah, no, but it's like, it's no shade , but yeah, everybody ha has a type and that's not wrong either. Or at least for a blind date. Like it's different if you meet someone. And you'd vibe with them. You have things in common then like the attraction can grow. But if this is just some random person, like you wanna know that there's gonna be some baseline attraction. Right.
Sara:Well, going back to you digressed anyway, essentially, I feel like I love approaching life in a way where like I have as much information as you know as possible and I can plan and make the best of a situation that I might ultimately not have control over. But I feel like I. You know, that's what we both want from our, for our patients. That's what people want for themselves. They want, you know, autonomy, they want the ability to make the decisions that they, they think are best. And like I always tell my patients, it's my job to give you all the information you need to make the best decision for yourself.
Supraja:I have to remind myself too, like, I don't wanna judge, I don't wanna make anyone feel judged. I wanna provide the knowledge that I've spent. My whole career cultivating, but then recognize that people make their own decisions, that they get information from other places. They have to do something they're gonna feel comfortable with and live with that they made that decision. Yeah, so respecting that and. If it's within my ability , to facilitate their choices or make that be as safe as it can be, then I'm there to do that.
Sara:Yeah. So bring up these topics. I think they're fun, they're interesting.
Supraja:yeah. What do we have to, if you're someone who's done these things and we didn't scare you away, you should write in, cuz we would love to talk to you about it.
Sara:We'd love to, you know, we can do a little feature. Yeah. You can teach us we're, we love learning
Supraja:I'll box. Breathe.
Sara:Let one of the midwives put saline bubbles in my back one time.
Supraja:How was it?
Sara:I think that's part of the hypnobirthing process. Yeah. It's like one of the pain. Just like, like tractors, directors. Yeah, we, yeah, it was incredibly painful anyways, but probably if you were contracting at the same time, you would be confused. I'd be like, go back. Anyways. We have a part two coming up because there's just too many good trends to talk about. Yeah. What do we have?
Supraja:Maybe not next week, but coming up in the future. So also, if you have more birthing trends you want us to discuss on part two, send us a message about that too. We're at. Gyn & Tonic podcast. Gyn spelt G Y N can find us anywhere. What? What? Tell them what the birthing trends are coming up. Okay. Ones we were considering talking about water birth, like in a tub. Vaginal seeding. Cord banking.
Sara:Home birth.
Supraja:Home birth. I was too scared to say that one. Are we gonna do it? We're gonna educate ourselves, open our minds before we talk about it. So get ready. And again, yeah, if you've done it, let us know.
Sara:Well, anyways, have a beautiful night.
Supraja:Bye bye.